[Release] From Base to Base 2

[CarThief]

Ah well, as they say, Duke mappers may die, but they never quit, eh?
EDIT: I forgot to mention, this requires Duke Plus 2.09.

In any case made a level in good time. Its sort of based on the previous map, but since there is more elements to toy with now in Duke Plus i also added more creative things.

Well i hope the gameplay is an improvement over the last version, though Come Get Some is still meant to be hard, and you're bound to die once or twice to things you've never seen before. :P

Hope thats all bugs sorted out as well. Oh, dont mind the heavy supply of ammo, and health in this map you're supposed to die fighting, not by a stray shot in the back while searching for that bit of health out of desperation.
If things are too hard there's always some tips along with spoilers in the txt file.

Oh, please also report any bugs you might see, if they're not already listed in the .txt file.

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DNR Download

[Gambini]

How much it is based on the previous map? Both screenshots look a lot like the first map. In any case: is this supposed to be a continuation or a remake?

[CarThief]

Uh, it kinda continues from the previous map, but it has some different elements.
And no more instakill pigcops either, though expect enemies to still pose a threat, in particular plenty of lizard troopers to deal with, i guess.

Else you could take a look in it by using mapster if you're really curious, i guess? Thats what i sometimes do. :P
Well, in short, i'd say its an improvement over the first one. Though yes, it kind of is a part 2 of the map. If you didnt like the first one i'm not sure if you'll like the second, but worth a try, no?

Ah, and didnt have room for this screenshot on the first post. I'll just put it here.
Mind you, most of the map is inside, and in uh... corridors and other thin places, it still offers a interesting firefight with lizard troopers though. They like to teleport and hit you in the back, if they can.

[Gambini]

Heh  i liked your previous map, unfortunately i don´t have too much time these days to play. I will eventually of course 

[Dan G]

I started playing this.  So far it seems a bit better than its predecessor.  I will probably replace FBTB with FBTB2 in the DukePlus hub for the next release.

I haven't gotten far, however, and there's a few problems.  The turrets in the first room with monsters won't shoot at anything.  It looks like they are having trouble seeing, perhaps because they are tucked so far into those nooks.  The other thing --and I don't think it's a problem with your map, but it's something I noticed when using the latest EDuke32-- the range on the explosions from destrucitible objects seems to be too great.  I was getting hurt by fire extinguishers and similar explosives from the other side of the room.

I would make the transition effects faster.  There's no need to make the player wait almost ten seconds for the fade out/in effect, with the right SE and settings it can be made to work much faster than that.

Currently I'm stuck in that area after the first transition.  I'm tired and I didn't spent a lot of time looking, so maybe I'm missing something obvious.

The gameplay in my Attrition mod is much better than DP.  I'm thinking about importing DP map effects over to Attrition so that DP maps can be played with it.  Not sure I want to do that though.

[CarThief]

Ah, i'm not very familiar with that mod, but speaking of the map, i think you are in the area where you get a shotgun, yes? There should be a vent in the upper side's wall to continue. And those turrets are supposed to be "broken" kind of, merely decoration i guess. A bit of a secret is that they drop items when destroyed though.

Hmm... I never realized that effect could be done faster, though it never bothered me. Maybe i'll make it faster along with some other edits if there's any more reason to edit it, like a bug or something, or if i wont edit it, i dont mind if you do if you're going to replace it before i even edit it, i guess.

[Headless_Horseman]

I'm thinking about importing DP map effects over to Attrition so that DP maps can be played with it.  Not sure I want to do that though.

I'll love that : playing TTA2 with Attrition must be crazy !

[Dan G]

I'm getting the sense that this map is going to be a long, hard slog.

I just passed an area that used a fuse puzzle.  But I didn't realize that I was supposed to collect fuses until I had wandered back and forth for a while.  With all the junk littering all the rooms, I didn't notice the fuses at first.  One oddity:  after two fuses are placed, two others magically appear and the door unlocks.  You should make those other two visible at the start.

The next area ended with a lot of liztroops standing above some very deadly gun emplacements.  Not the standard turrets, but some kind of shooters that apparently were triggered to blow up when I killed the last of the liztroops.  At least I think that's what happened.  Anyway, a pretty clever use of DP effects, but the gameplay was brutal.  The guns start firing with no warning and there is very little cover.

You have placed some very deadly liztroops in this map.  The scariest are the suicide bombers who can teleport behind you.  I think you should give distinctive pals (like 17, 23, etc) to the monsters who have the deadliest attributes, so you have some warning before engaging them.  Also, I think you overuse the extra hit points on liztroops.  It seemed like nearly every liztroop took at least 2 shotgun hits to kill.

[CarThief]

Strange, most lizard troopers only take one shotgun attack from me before they fall (except captains), though it was easier on me because i was aware of where they are placed. I'm not sure what you want me to do about the fuses, i'm not sure how the bug happens and i merely followed insturctions from the site, this problem is also listed in the map's .txt file.

Ah well, i guess the gameplay is harder then your average map, i buffed up nearly every monster with something, most lizard troopers tend to teleport, kind of requiring a fast reaction to either turn around and shoot or take cover. Hmm... Perhaps i made it too hard? Though i personally really like this type of gameplay, just requires some reflexes, apparently.
I assume your shots didnt hit the lizard troopers fully since they can take newcomers by suprise and teleport around em?

[Mikko_Sandt]

Though i personally really like this type of gameplay, just requires some reflexes, apparently.

Easy to say when you designed it. You know exactly where all the aliens are and how they behave.

[Dan G]

You have placed some very deadly liztroops in this map.  The scariest are the suicide bombers who can teleport behind you.  I think you should give distinctive pals (like 17, 23, etc) to the monsters who have the deadliest attributes, so you have some warning before engaging them.  Also, I think you overuse the extra hit points on liztroops.  It seemed like nearly every liztroop took at least 2 shotgun hits to kill.

I'm quoting myself here because I want you to notice that I never said they were too hard.  What I said is that the deadliest monsters should be given distinctive pals so they can be identified as such on sight.  For example, if I know that the teleporting suicide bombers are purple, then I can quickly move forward when I see them teleport to avoid the blast.  If I don't know they are suicide bombers, I turn around to shoot them and then get blown up.

[CarThief]

Hmm... I guess giving them a obvious colour might help showing they're dangerous. Think i'll try that at some point, though i didnt have much other feedback yet.

As for knowing everything in the map, i guess it has its good and bad sides, atleast i find it enjoyable to play at times, especially parts like the past area that might just get me regardless of knowing all.

Hmm... There's ALOT of lizard troopers with suicide bombing capabilities though, they rarely even try to blow up near me, is it really that needed?
Oh, speaking of suicide bombing lizard troopers, if shot while begging they explode, kinda neat, but i'm not sure if its a bug or on purpose. It helps if they have allies near them though, but not so convenient if you're trying to kick them in the head.

[Headless_Horseman]

I liked this map, your style is really consistent and I loved that rooms full of stuff. And I really appreciate that spots when you have to be careful or some deadly machine will rip you apart. Indiana Duke ?
However, some rooms are really too much, like that big wall and its turrets with bouncing shots and damned liztroops that shots lighning, or the minoboss with flame chaingun. This stuff is really deadly if you put it in a room with few space to move or dodge.
Also, the "go through this section / transition effect / repeat" gameplay rapidly becames boring and that transition effect is just too damn slow.
Apart from this, I'm really curious to see your next maps !

[CarThief]

Ah, glad someone likes it. Though in some cases you may want to take cover instead of trying to dodge, the first... turret wall thing you encounter has some boxes to hide behind, or atleast that's my usual tactic.

Did intend that particular battlelord to require some dodging (if he gets close enough he shoots you over the crate), but lots of jumping tends to help. Hmm... Guess it might be a good idea to sometime speed up the transition effect, i dont recall lizard troopers shooting lightning though. Maybe tracer fireballs, "railguns" and some flak projectile, but they dont shoot lightning. :P
Biggest reason for using transition effects is mostly laziness and more freedom to make stuff. This compared to elevators is alot simpler and quicker, though at the time i was unaware of a function to speed it up.

Well guess i'll improve it sometime later, more obvious cover in some spots, other stuff, faster transition. Hmm... What else...

[Puritan]

Map uploaded  and first post edited.
Thanks to Forge for yet another good review.